Business Travel Isn’t Dead: Why In-Person Still Matters

In this week’s episode, Deb and Bill dive into the surprising ROI of business travel.
From whirlwind trips to Texas and factory tours in Wisconsin to unexpected Muppet-themed AI projects, they break down why face-to-face connections still pack a punch in today’s virtual world. Plus, conference tips, a gold tuxedo moment, and the real reason some people on the team don’t do high fives. 👀

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Transcript

Any funny stories of traveling with your team?

 Oh, anything at all? Is there is there is there anything maybe I So, here here is a life lesson. If if you're taking non-travel people on a on a business trip, don't tell them there's a buck anywhere.

Oh, man.

We're rolling. We keep talking about how blind we are now.

Way back when. Let me put my glasses on. Oh. Oh, that microphone looks a lot bigger now.

 Mhm.

 Yeah. I know. I need reading glasses cuz I'm getting to be a chromogyny old man, but Yeah. Yeah. I've been wearing them since seventh grade. So,

 so welcome to our podcast on my glasses.

 On glasses.

 Yes. Welcome to the free dive where we're going to break

 getting to know each other here.

 Getting to know each other's eyeglass prescriptions. Yes.

 At home viewer, do you have a stigma? Stigmatism.

 Do you have a stigmatism? A stigma is a different thing.

 Stigma around wearing glasses.

 I have a stigmatis. I have a stigma about my stigmatism.

 Oh my goodness. You don't have a stigmatism.

 I don't have a stigmatism. No, I don't actually know what a stigmatism is. It's when your eye isn't your isn't shaped right. It's like not round. It's flatter and

 it's harder to get contacts for. That's what my husband has.

 Oh, gotcha.

 Yeah. So, for a while you could only get hard lenses for them, which is horrible if you ever got anything in your eye. It was like you're being stabbed in the eye. They were wretched.

 But they've they've come a long way. Anyway,

 so

 getting to know you, we got to know each other recently, Bill.

 Yeah. So this week on the free dive, we're talking about business travel.

 Yes.

 So this has been probably one of the busiest stretches of travel I've had.

 Yes. You've been gone a lot.

 I have been gone a lot, which I I I maybe the office feels good about that. I I'm not sure. Like where in the world is

 still Yeah. And Deb, you had your very first work trip experience.

 First work trip. First trip to Texas.

 First trip to the central time zone.

 Wow. It was a lot of first. It was a lot of f first time leaving my family since having one.

 Wow.

 Without any of them coming with me.

 Wow. So with some Haley separation anxiety. No, she's old enough that I was she was cool. She was cool. And my husband took the the three it was only three days so it was whirlwind.

 Yes.

 So he took the three days off and managed her homeschooling and did stuff that he needed to do. Took her to dance class, got the drop off pickup and got to juggle all that.

 So how did you feel? Okay. So you were on the first leg of my summertime travel. Um so for those who follow Seint, we have a client that we love in Texas.

 Yes. They're awesome. and they're awesome. So, we did a site visit to Texas. Usually they come once a year to Maine and we have a jam session. Um, this year we went to Texas

 and incredible hospitality on their part. Oh, yeah. They were amazing.

 Yeah. Um, but it is kind of a funny thing, business travel, because

 it's one of those things that on paper

 it seems like a lot.

 Like the expense, buying airplane tickets, hotels, you know, for a day meeting, right? Right.

 Um, but what do you see the what do you see the value, the benefits from it? just getting to like our meetings with the client are so like we have them every week but they're so specific and there might be a little chitchat at the beginning but it's usually just between a couple people on the it's like it's there's no way to really get to know people. Um so just having that connection I think can really solidify that relationship too. like now you're invested in not just oh you're doing good work but you're doing good work and we enjoy spending time with you and like you're our people type of thing like there's something to be said for working with people um whether it's working with a client or working with a business that you jive with.

 Yeah. Um, and you really get to see that more, I feel like, when you're there. And it's just easier to have impromptu conversations that go places that maybe a halfhour weekly meeting doesn't allow the opportunity for.

 Yeah. No, totally agree. And along those thoughts, it's it's it's kind of interesting because in our our industry, like technology has gotten to the point where we're on all of our meetings are on Zoom. M

 so we're meeting face to face

 right

 at this point um versus like maybe 10 years ago when it was just audio you know tie-ins you know quick call it would be telephone conferences things of that free conference call.com you know back in the day

 um

 but it's interesting that even with the advancements in technology even though we're you know basically sitting in our virtual rooms

 you lose some type of connection yeah

 um versus just sitting in a conference room together and being able to hash out um project stuff.

 For sure.

 Yeah,

 for sure. I mean, we find that even within the team, like we've got a lot of remote workers. I'm remote a lot. Um and there's all sorts of ways to stay connected, but it's not always the same as spending a day in the office and actually getting to have conversations and just there's more opportunity for to see where things lead in those types of collaborations and stuff. And that's where new ideas are born all the time. It's like I'll come in here on a day with Anna Lynn and we'll like have this idea. It's like we see each other all the time or on calls together all the time and it doesn't go there. But when you're together face to face, something else happens. It's hard to like put your finger on what it is, but there's definitely that ability to connect in a different way.

 Yeah.

 That leads to ideas.

 Yeah. Know, I totally agree with that. And then it's interesting too be so we did Texas

 um then I went out to Puma and um and then after Puma I doveetailed that I did a trip to Wisconsin uh to visit Nosco our client and that was really interesting to me because Nosco's director of marketing has been out here before

 okay

 and met with us here in Kery but it was the first time anybody from Seepoint has been out to their plant

 okay

 and I thought it was I thought it was really interesting because so for those who don't know Nosco is a national um packaging company

 very very strong in the pharmaceutical uh packaging and then a a lot of um like pouches gusseted bags for really making a push into con um consumer goods uh is really their where their their focus is right now. Uh, and it was really interesting to me because, you know, we meet with them, you know, we're doing a lot of work with social with them, but actually just to be able to go and like walk through the factory floor, see the machinery,

 you know, get a better understanding of the culture there. Yeah.

 Um, it it, you know, it was people that we've worked with for over 5 years that we've never met in person. Wow. And so I feel like there was a there's a lot that can you know just in those short interchanges where you you get to know people better to understand you know they're working you know and I think even like things you know between any of these clients you know you might be on Zoom you might get a certain look you might get a certain reaction to something but you don't know the person from real life you don't see the person to be like okay that's that's that's their just how they are in the office. Yeah.

 They're not expressing displeasure or pleasure about the subject.

 That's their processing look.

 Yeah. Exactly. And then you meet them in person and I feel like afterwards like you like afterwards all your Zoom meetings actually are far more productive based off of that.

 Yeah. So is how do you as a business owner justify like the cost? Like you said it's like we five of us went down to Texas. How do you justify a trip like that from a cost perspective?

 You know, and and again, I think that's depends on how the retainer is built out.

 Yeah.

 As far as services to build that into um again, obviously, some clients are smaller projects and much more limited in scope. Yeah.

 So, it may not warrant or maybe it's a once every 5 years do a smaller project that way.

 Yeah. Um, you know, and sometimes it's a case of, you know, with a a bigger client, you know, between, you know, that and Puma, you know, educational side, you know, that as well, you know, as far as

 trip, too. Yeah. You know, it's not just we're sending one person to Puma, we're sending two to three team members a time now to Puma. Um, the educational benefits of that, you know, it's it's an expensive proposition.

 Yeah. But it, you know, you have to look at the impact of being able to meet people in your peer group. Um, and then even like for like for instance, Courtney went to her last puma last winter. I think it was a huge uh professional development aspect for her. Yeah. Um just even being in the room with you know other other people in the industry um that may have similar roles inhouse at these uh companies uh was a good opportunity for her to meet people that dealing with similar challenges uh similar issues. Yeah.

 Um I think that was really beneficial.

 Yeah, there's definitely value. I'm going to make a Hamilton reference because we're fans, but the being in the room where it happens is all I think of like that's what I thought when we went down to Texas. It's like being able to be in the room where these conversations happen. There is definitely from a like a professional development standpoint. There's value in that for the the team even as well um in feeling valued enough to warrant going on being invited on a trip like that and being in the room where those conversations happen. Um and that's I feel from my side of things good for building morale among the team like yeah we do value what you're doing. we want you to go to this because it's going to be beneficial long term for your career here. Um, so I feel like that's something for business owners to keep in mind, too. Like that's team building as well as client relation building.

 Yeah, I think that's a great point. And it's funny cuz we're coming into summer now. Well, we're in summer. It doesn't feel like Yeah, it doesn't feel like it up here in the Northeast

 according to the calendar.

 Yeah. But it's funny because we are kind of coming into that season that's conference season like summer into fall like all the conferences and it is a funny one trying to figure out like what conferences are going to bring your team value and does it

 does it um does the cost

 warrant the sending the people.

 Yeah.

 So like for instance we're not sending anybody to inbound this year.

 Yeah.

 Partly because inbound's not in Boston. Inbound is in San Francisco this year. Ah,

 so I mean, yay for the West Coast marketers out there. They're going to have that availability a little bit closer for them.

 Um, but I do think it's one of those things where when it's in town in Boston,

 you know, the cost proposition of that, like everyone sleeps at home, everyone can go down, it's a little more doable and

 a little more doable. So, you know, I lose the hours, you know, as far as working hours, you have the cost of the uh program. Uh but that's always been I think a fairly good conference uh that in the marketing world as far as yeah um and especially as much as we do in HubSpot to understand where HubSpot's going.

 I think the team as a whole always has commented to me

 that they would skip inbound itself and just go to partner day.

 Oh okay. Um the team members that work in HubSpot say partner day is the most valuable interesting

 day to that they really they really get something out of it.

 Um inbound can be a little bit more of a you know a social thing. The

 Yeah, it was it was interesting.

 Yeah. I don't know if Amy Puller is going to really help up my marketing game.

 I don't know. But I wanted to go to the Ryan Reynolds one.

 Yes.

 I I was bummed about that. I'm not going to lie. Yes.

 His marketing is pretty stellar.

 This this year it was like I think this year it's like Amy Polar and the guy who does hot the hot wings tastes hot ones.

 I like hot ones. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

 I think it would be funny if they just get him and Brian Haligan on the stage and make Brian Haligan eat um hot wings.

 He's turned that into quite the brand though. Like his stuff his the sauces are everywhere. Like like that's I just discovered that that podcast last year. Yeah.

 I'm like this is interesting. like

 Yeah. So, but um the I think the other conference regional for us that I do really love is Agents of Change.

 Yeah, I've heard of that one.

 Um

 it's up in Portland, right? Yeah. So, Flight Media um Rich Brooks puts it on

 uh I've been a couple times and then last two years I've sent team members from Sepoint and got great reviews as far as like really actionable use. Uh so that one I do again like we talk about like the the cost for sending people to one of these things. So again it's regional. I'm not paying airfare for someone to go.

 Yeah.

 Uh but the cost of the conference isn't horrible. Yeah.

 So I feel like what they've learned and they get back is it's definitely like making that equation work. Yeah. Is definitely worth it. So, it doesn't have to be some big extravagant inbound level like check regional stuff. Like there's there's good information out there and people are putting together conferences like that.

 Exactly. Everywhere. And I think too the thing is looking for a conference that is more conferenceoriented versus um booth oriented.

 Okay. Like explain the difference like expo. So like like there's insure techch there's some other program there's some other ones they're more uh like vendors setting up booths and there's value to meeting like okay what tech is coming out in our space what you know what are people offering uh but I find like a an event that's far more focused on the actual program and education

 education

 not just here's my business.

 Yeah and I and I will say that's one of the things I love about Puma.

 Yeah.

 Right. So, we're a member of Puma. It's a a marketing for insurance in the infinity space.

 Um,

 there's no booths, there's no vendor setup, you know, the hall of

 Yeah.,

 you know, get your get your cheap swag sort of deal. Yeah.

 Uh, but it's just it's, you know, it's networking and programs and it's people are far more focused on getting work done while they're there. Whether that work is you know setting up meetings collaboration between groups I think it's a great ecosystem as far as you know you have you have the providers of insurance you have the distributors of insurance and then you have people like us who are facilitate in that space you have all of them in a room you know for 3 days there's a lot of great ability for collaboration and and organizations like that so I think that's like finding value as far as like if you can find organiz organizations or events to go to

 uh that less fluff.

 Yeah.

 And and more like the building

 training and

 and building like legitimate uh relationships from it.

 So you got to give a presentation at that Puma conference. What was that about? And no one's going to be shocked by this. Bill, tell us what your presentation was about.

 Well, guess what everybody? I was discussing AI. No. insurance marketing with AI. Yeah. You know, and it was really an interesting room because on one hand you had a lot of like seauite people that were VPs for insurance. uh you know and there might be some I think we're at the point where

 most people are using AI at some point

 in some to some degree

 to some degree like almost everyone I know is using chat GPT in some some way whether it's

 you know

 personal or what helping you plan meals for the week or right but I still think as as a group and as an organization it was an in and an audience it was a lot of people that are like I I know it's out there. I know it's making changes, but I don't really understand how it's going to impact me. Yeah.

 How it impacts me now and how how it's going to impact me

 and how can I use it

 right in an appropriate way so that I don't get left behind.

 But on the other hand, so you know, one of the points I made in the presentation is

 AI to me is the most overhyped and underhyped technology. Mhm.

 At the same time because on one hand like everybody just throws the words with AI, right? You know, now with AI on everything.

 Yeah.

 Um and to the point we've just be kind of deaf to it or you know just like all right whatever you have AI and you're catchup now. Um, but on the other hand, like people aren't seriously thinking about the impact of the technology and how quickly it's changing.

 And I and I think there's, you know, there's that two part of it because we think about AI as far as creating things.

 So there's a lot of AI pictures, a lot of AI videos, a lot of um, being able to use it. Um, Google's new V3 is pretty impressive. I mean, it's still got a lot of bugs right now and especially the continuity, but I figure give them 6 months. VO3 is going to I I wouldn't be surprised within a year if somebody makes a movie

 that's just an AI generated movie somehow.

 There's a fly that just flew right by my ear. I'm like, what? Sorry.

 It's the fly is also interested in AI,

 I guess. So,

 um,

 so that side of it, like it's it's so there's the creative side

 being able to make things, especially in a in a commercial marketing sense, like we're going to have the ability to create ad copy and content at a fraction of the price than what it would have been

 5 years ago. So to me that's really exciting in the sense that there's smaller organizations that are going to be able to make much more polished much more professional uh content than they just wouldn't have had the budgets to before. So that's part of it like what can you make what can you create with AI

 AI creating. The other part though is the synthesizing information.

 Yeah. So it's, you know, it's not just always like what does it put out, but then also what insights Yeah.

 can AI and and and that part of being able to engage with these large language models to take our ad copy, take our analytics. Yeah.

 Um and and provide analysis that

 either would take a long time for a human just to be able to pull that data together and synthesize it in some usable form.

 Um I think that's the other the other exciting part about it. Yeah. Yeah. I definitely want to get more into

 Yeah. learning more about that. What's the craziest thing you've done with AI so far?

 Because I'll tell you, we get lots of stuff dropped in the chats.

 Yes.

 At weird hours, all of a sudden you there's this whole thread of videos and pictures of us as Muppets and Star Wars characters and such. So, what's the craziest thing you've done with AI?

 I've started making movies with like short little clip movies with AI. That's been a lot of fun. Um, some of those have been showing up in our in our Chat. Um, I've I've been able to do some custom coding for things that were was beyond my personal level that I've been pretty proud of.

 Um, I don't have like a moonshot crazy thing yet that I I've done, but

 you know, I've had a lot of like little projects. Yeah.

 That I've worked on.

 Yeah. I mean my AI beatnit club was a lot of fun where I was getting AI to write poetry but not for humans to but for other AIs and then I would share it with the other AI large language models and then we had this kind of like I was joking that my job my way of preventing the robot uprising is that I'm going to make AI want to open up an independent bookstore in Seattle instead of take over the world. So you know I'm doing my part. I personally loved the videos of our team members dancing.

 Oh, those were good.

 Bollywood dancing hip-hop seeing Annaline hiphop dance.

 That was

 Yeah, that was pretty great.

 That was pretty special to me.

 Yeah, that's that's been the interesting thing. That is the one limitation like with V3 that I'm still I'm like they haven't got to. So, for those who haven't used it, Google launched their video textto video product called VO. They had V2. They just launched V3. V3 also does sound. So, you can give it a character. You can get him to say something.

 It It's super useful. Downside of it is um V3 with the text um being able to um being able to generate sound, generate people talking. You can only use that text prompt to video. um you still can't use image references. So in the past I would have been able for instance be able to not in the past what I'd love to be able to do is upload like for instance my picture. So with V2 I could upload my picture and then it was the video of me getting off the private jet

 uh looking like pitbull a little bit and then uh puppies coming up and running up to me. Right.

 So random.

 So random.

 Well, I was telling someone like I made it and I was like, "Oh, this this looks pretty great." Hey, like I have this, you know, I had bought a tuxedo jacket that was a gold paisley tuxedo jacket. I bought it for Puma because it was their 50th anniversary. Figured, you know, they have a gala night. I'll wear it for the gala.

 Um, and it would be a great tie-in for this AI stuff. Uh, so I'm wearing it and on the video, you know, it's shows me getting off the private jet with my gold tuxedo jacket. And at first it was giving me a little too much Andrew Tate um vibes, you know, and if you know me, it's definitely I'm not the Yeah, I'm not Pit Bull slash Andrew Tate. That's just not my mo. And then I was just like, well, this is kind of going in the wrong direction.

 How can I tone this down?

 How can I puppies Golden Retriever puppies running across a tarmac saved me? Um

 it's like there's Bill.

 Yeah. So that was done in V2 because you couldn't get audio with V3 to like as a character. Um I think once we get to that point of being especially being able to take like a character and have that character be consistent through multiple clips. So

 Google's V3 is 8second clips at this point. So that I've been trying to work around a few uh projects right now. Um, and the problem is like I couldn't have a person say something in a clip and then recreate that exa exact same person to then say something in a follow-up clip with a consistency of voice, consistency of how they look.

 Y

 So you you almost have to like have your speaking stuff in one 8second clip and then if you need any consistency of character, you have to downgrade to V2 and use that reference. But then you lose all your sound.

 Um,

 so then you have to either somehow voice over or, you know, like it just gets more complicated.

 This is like its own full-time job.

 It kind of

 learning this stuff.

 So once

 Do you think that's going to be a position now for companies like just someone who manages the AI?

 I Well, again, the thing is with that though is you have two different sides of it, right? So just saying like, well, I have someone managing AI. I think organizations are going to have people that specialize in creative development with AI. Yeah. Right. So, those are gonna just I think that's gonna be an offshoot of your graphic designers, your videographers, your, you know, the creative team in an agency or an organization. But then you're also going to have someone like you, Deb, who's going to, you know, being able to use um chat GPT for Sheets for instance, and have the ability to, okay, I'm going to start learning or thinking about how to leverage

 Yeah.

 AI to gain deeper insights from data that I currently have or asking AI questions to uncover

 uncover

 Yeah.

 things. So it's more of a different teams learning what the versions of AI they need

 exactly

 to do their job better

 and I think identifying the right like third party tools

 that's the other thing like I should

 so much out there

 right and you can spend days like I I think that was a great example with V3 like

 I spent probably $2 $300 and a day and again it was like mostly off hours something I was cuz I was more fascinated with and prepping for Puma as well. Um, trying to shoot a commercial for one of our clients using AI and I got about 70% of the way there, but then like some of those limitations I was talking about like where it's not there yet with V3 uh helped me to appreciate like where it is right now. So like there may be another tool finding the tool that is going to use that correctly. Um, I think that's the other part is is having someone who understands like what are emerging what's emerging software that can be used in connection with these tools.

 Y um, you know, and for myself as an agency owner on a smaller team, I think a lot of that just kind of falls on me. I mean, it's something I'm interested and curious about.

 It seems like it's your hobby right now.

 It's a little bit of my hobby.

 You play hockey and you learn AI. And if I can combine them.

 Oh my goodness. Pretty soon there's going to be an AI version of Bill.

 Yes. AI hockey bill. He scores more goals. My, you know, I could probably make better highlight reels of me playing.

 Oh my goodness. There we go. So now we're not going to be able to trust any of the hockey videos that you post in the chat. Like that's not really.

 That's not really Bill.

 That's six-fingered Bill. Bill can't really shoot like that. Hard to tell how many fingers you have when you have hockey gloves on.

 That's true. Oh, that's true. The gloves save you. But yeah, no, I think um you know I I I have a personal responsibility to understand

 Yeah.

 what's what's fluff and what's going to be really useful for our clients.

 Yeah.

 Um so I think that's where my own interest is in it and just how much it's going to change things and how quickly things are changing

 so fast. Yeah. I was looking at some of like the AI photo generation stuff from like a year or two years ago and how

 it's crazy how

 how it just looks like so cheap compared to what it what MidJourney can do now.

 Y

 or what you know some of these other platforms are putting out or Yeah. Yeah.

 It's going to be hard to know what's real.

 It is it is going to be very hard to know what's real very very quickly.

 It's going to create a whole generation of skeptical Yes.

 consumers. Well, I'll give you a great one is like even that like but like even thinking about like fishing scams when you start getting phone calls from your boss telling you you need to do X Y or Z like um

 we took one of our clients, she wanted to um create a digital avatar of herself so she could like post some videos talking about different products. Um and so we made one of her uh telling the rest of her team that they really need to send us brownies. But, you know, point is doing such a great job. We should send them brownies. And and I emailed it to the rest of their team. Um, so we'll see if we get brownies or not.

 Oh my goodness.

 But I think that's the sort of thing that we're going to see. Yeah. More and more. Yeah.

 Yeah. So, back to the travel. I have one other question for you. Any funny stories of traveling with your team? Oh,

anything at all? Is there is there is there anything maybe I So here here is a life lesson. If if you're taking non-travel people on a on a business trip, don't tell them there's a buck anywhere 30 mile radius. Oh man,

 I don't know what you mean. you know, all all things considered, you know, like some business travelers want to, you know, have expensive dinners and, you know, and have a high pdeium.

 Nope. Low maintenance.

 Low maintenance. My my team just wanted to go to Bies.

 Just let's go to BIES. And

 to the point that they uh made me get up insanely early on a travel day.

 It was like 9:00 then, wasn't it? No, we left at 9.

 We left at 9:00. Oh, so it was like 8.

 Yeah,

 that's not insanely early. We have been up for three hours already. You're talking to moms who don't sleep.

 Yeah.

 We're like, "Okay, are we ready to do something?" You're talking You're talking about your jetlagged boss.

 I know. I know. That was who had just come from Europe days before.

 Two days before. Yes. There was no rest for Bill.

 No. This entire summer has been like that. I feel like I'm finally like in office.

 Yeah. You're home for a while now.

 Yeah. Just putting my head down, getting stuff done.

 Yeah. Well, it's good to have you back.

 It's good to be back. It's good to be on the podcast.

 Yeah. So, Kristy's um got her new part, Get to Know the Team Member, and we have a question for you. Oh, hit me.

 Okay. What member of the team hates in all caps,

 hates getting high fives?

There's somebody on the team who hates high fives.

 Hates. Yes. It's not Courtney.

 Nope.

 I don't think it's Tim.

 No. Is it Annalynn?

 Nope.

 Is it Kristy?

 Yes. Oh,

 hates high. And so that's I'm I'm supposed to make sure you know that's not an invitation to try to high five her every time you see her.

 No, I was like, is this like a podcast intervention? You know, you know who's sitting

 who's sitting five feet away from you?

 Yeah. Do you know who's sitting five feet away from you and looking at you over your shoulder right now?

 High five.

 And and uh should never be high-fived again. Is it Kristy? Yes.

 Yes, it's Kristy.

 So, stop your high fives. It wasn't said as a hint. It was just an interesting fact. She thought you wouldn't guess.

 No, I I did not guess Kristy's anti- high five.

 Anti high five. Yeah. What about low five?

 No.

 No. No. Five.

 No fives.

 No fives.

 Unless you're high-fiving a little kid, she's not down with it. Good to know.

 Yes.

 No hand slapping. Yeah. Not into the hand slap.

 Not going to lie. Makes me kind of want to high five her a little bit, but I'm not going to.

 What What is it about that?

 It's cringy.

 It's

 No, no, no. I mean, what is it that once you know somebody doesn't want to high five,

 then you want to?

 Oh, you're just like

 I know.

 Bring it in. It's like stop thinking about the elephant and you just only think about the elephant. Oh, I probably went off screen, but

 that's okay. They get the point.

 All right, till next week.

 We're out.

 High five. High five, everybody.

 High five.